K6 233(3.2/3.3v) on single voltage mb(3.3v) - award bios

Don't ask how to over-clock.
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Sun Nov 26, 2006 6:57 pm

Greetings,
i have found that forum on google during an info search about my old pc motherboard.

The general pc config atm is P133, 16mb ram simm (8x2), rendition verite 2100pci 4mb+diamond monster 3d 4 mb, ess 1868 isa, 1.2 gb hd, dvd reader and a lan 10/100 pci card for cable connection.

Some days ago i decided to have some fun with it, and upgrading it as much as possible without changing the mainboard.
Because i would like to play old games, i searched on ebay a verite (for RRedline api based) and a voodoo1 (for glide api) as substitute of the old s3 trio64v+ (really crappy and useless card, i hated it!).

And i have ordered 4x32mb simm for upgrading ram too (disk swap is irritating during windows multitasking and internet navigation, of this forum too; i dunno how i was able to use it 10 years ago o_O)

But i have a problem with the CPU.
I want to add a cpu with mmx instructions, but pentium mmx require a different voltage setting from regular pentium, and i discovered that my mainboard has not any pin for changing it from 3.2 or 3.3 (the manual says it has, but from watching the board you can clearly see that these was removed, trasforming that in a single voltage mb)
After some searches i have discovered that there is a version of K6 cpus (the first one) that is capable of running on single voltage mb.
And that version can be found on ebay too (so is not like those powerleap adapter that are disappeared from earth's surface).

The problem now is:
Will my mainboard be (that teorically should be able to power on k6 cpu without cooking it) capable of recognizing this cpu and run it?
Or it will stuck on post?

Now, atm, that cpu have to be shipped yet, so i haven't still tested it.
However, when the pc was bought, on november 1996 (my 10th birthday :lol: ), k6 hasn't been released yet, so i think the answer is no.

However on google, searching my mb bios code, i have found that forum and specifically that topic:

http://www.wimsbios.com/phpBB2/viewtopi ... baecf6ce75

that seems to speak about my same (or at least very similar mainboard)
Reading the topic i have discovered that is possible to add microcode to mb bios for adding support to bigger HDs (or better, solving bugs with big hd space calculation) and cpu strings.

The problem is that the links in the topic for downloading the bios are no more valid, and on google the newest bios that i was able to find is the one that is already mounted on my mb (05/31/96)
So i am unable to try the bios linked in that thread.

Now let's speak about the subject of the problem.

These are the infos taken from post screen:
Award Modular Bios v4.51PG 1984-96
Award plug and play Bios extension v1.0A 1996

P54CE REV.F Release 5/31/1996 BIOS REV F.03 UM 8669

05/30/96 - i430VX
UMC8669 - 2A59GL1CC-00
and these from ctbios v1.5
BIOS-Info, c't/Andreas Stiller, V. 1.5 10/00
Computer ID : FC, SubTyp: 01, BIOS-Level: 0
Rechnertyp : AT-3, Konfigurationsbyte $70
Maustreiber : Microsoft kompatibel, Version: 08.30
Maustyp : Serielle Maus auf IRQ4
Bus : ISA/PCI
Hauptspeicher : 640 KB, davon verfügbar : 640 KB
Extended Memory : 15360 KB
BIOS Datum : 05/30/96
PCI-BIOS gefunden : Version 02.10, 32-Bit-PCI-BIOS Revision:0
PCI-Busse : 1, Konfig-Mech.: 1, Special-Cycle-Mech.: 0
Award BIOS gefunden : Award Modular BIOS v4.51PG
Award ID-String : 05/30/96-i430VX,UMC8669-2A59GL1CC-00
Board/BIOS-Version : P54CE REV.F RELEASE 5/31/1996 BIOS REV.F03 UM8669
OEM : LUCKY STAR
URL : http://www.cliser.com.tw/luckysta/bios.htm
Chipset : i430VX,UMC8669 //Intel Triton-VX
INT-13h BIOS Extension: ja, Version:1.x, Fknt 41..48 unterstützt
PnP (ACFG,ESCD,DMI) : PnP V1.0, APM V1.2
and these from ctdmi
DMI-Info, c't/Devid Espenschied (/as), V1.50, 02/2001
PnP-Struktur bei : F000:C2D0, Checksum: 00, V1.0, API: F000:C31D, Sel: F000
SM-Strukur : nicht gefunden
DMI-Struktur : nicht gefunden
Kein DMI verfügbar, Programm wird beendet.
Now there is a problem:

the manual does not says who is the constructor of the mainboard but call the board (or at least a variant of my board) with the acronim SL-586V
Google results says that SL-586V is an 430vx based board from Sian Lì, and not from lucky star, as written on award ami bios recognition page.

However maybe is the manual that does not exactly describe my mainboard.

Ipotizing that it is a Lucky Star mb, there are 2 possible versions:
- P54CE 5I-VX2, as said on award ami page
- P54CE 5I-VX1, as said on the following webpage:

http://www.plasma-online.de/index.html? ... ystar.html


Now, sintetizing:
- where i can found the exact model of my mainboard?
- can you help me on adding k6 support to my bios?
- and can you broke 8gb limit too? (i havent tested bigger HDs but that limit should be present in MBs of that period)




Sorry for the long post but i had to explain all the situation for a better understanding.
And sorry for some grammar error too, english is not my motherlanguage :P
KachiWachi
The New Guy
Posts: 1451
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2002 10:32 pm
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Mon Nov 27, 2006 2:47 pm

Short answers to a rather long post (hint - sometimes shorter is sweeter)...

If the board does not provide separate VCore and VI/O, then an adapter will be required.

Which K6 did you order?

Consult Jan Steunebrink for BIOS patching (see my sig).

Thanks.
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:02 pm

I dont think it will require an adaptator

read here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amd_k6
K6 (Model 6)

8.8 million transistors in 350 nm
L1-Cache: 32 + 32 KiB (Data + Instructions)
MMX
Socket 7
Front side bus: 66 MHz
First release: April 2, 1997
VCore: 2.9 V (166/200) 3.2/3.3V (233)
Clockrate: 166, 200, 233 MHz
I have found the 233mhz version, that use the same voltage of my pentium 133.

The problem maybe will be the bios not recognizing K6
cp
BIOS Guru
Posts: 1914
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 9:07 pm
Location: Germany

Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:45 pm

http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/superpower ... -586V.html

hope that this is your mainboard (thanks edwin!). AMD K6 3.2v can be used with 3.3v vcore, too. just make sure the fan on the cpu is big enough to cool the transitor, too. the K6 will draw as much as 9.5A current (worst case) and that's more than the power transistor is specified for. but it can handle it with some additional air cooling. looks like the voltage regulator is build around a LP2951 and a power transistor (the device on the heatsink, D45H8 maybe?). no special bios modifications needed for a K6..just make sure using SetK6 or linux. for the hdd barrier: use linux or an overlay software. or just use a small hdd..8GB should be more than enough for a bunch of old games.
edwin
The Hardware Archivist
Posts: 6227
Joined: Wed Mar 20, 2002 7:11 pm
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Mon Nov 27, 2006 11:48 pm

So one of the LuckyStar P54CE boards is similar to the San-Li Sl-586V??? That would be a kicker 8O

If it isn't too much trouble, can you email me a clean picture of the board and scans from the manual pages?
edwin/evasive

Do not assume anything

System error, strike any user to continue...
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Tue Nov 28, 2006 11:30 am

i can email you the scanned pages from the manuals (i have three manuals for that board; and one is the same of another but with two pages corrected)
but i dont know how to send you board photos because i dont have a digital camera :(

the board in the photo that u linked is pretty much similar (same slots; same ram position; same cache and socket positions) but the jumpers near the socket on my board are not here: instead there is a plain part of metal (maybe alluminium))

and that is the thing that is making me think that is a single voltage mb
because i cant change voltage settings

however when i will have the time i will scan you manual's pages



@cp: can you please modify (or send an email) the photo that you linked here and indicate in it, with a red sign, where is the power transistor?
So i can eventually buy some video card passive copper dissipator and attack it here.

However the fan should be big enough, it support k6 up to 550mhz
cp
BIOS Guru
Posts: 1914
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 9:07 pm
Location: Germany

Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:19 pm

the power transistor is the device attached to the heatsink. it's on the right side of the cpu socket. the huge silver thing is the heatsink.
the easiest solution would be to mount a 80mm fan (from an old PSU maybe or buy a new one for a buck ;)) on the cpu and let it overleap towards the heatsink. don't try to remove the heatsink: you'd rather break the power transistor than get anything removed there. and attaching another heatsink to the heatsink isn't very helpful: the termal resistance would be too big.

btw. the mainboard in the picture is a single voltage board, too. on the right side of the cpu socket there is a red jumper. and right next to this jumper there is an IC. that's the LP2951 regulator. above that regulator there is an empty space on the mainboard. there's '2951' silkscreened to it. that's where the second regulator would have went if this would have been a split voltage board.
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:33 pm

I have a place where to mount and 8x8 fan on the front.
was thinking of mouting it for air intake, but if the X metal thing on the right side of the cpu is a dissipator, i will mount it for catching out hot air, because the 8x8 mouting position is just in front of that thing
KachiWachi
The New Guy
Posts: 1451
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2002 10:32 pm
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:17 pm

So you got a K6-233 MMX (Model 6), 233MHz (66x3.5).

K6-233 ANR(3.2v CORE)
VCore - 3.2V (3.1V~3.3V), 3.5V Max., 9.5A
VI/O - 3.3V (3.135V~3.6V), 4.0V Max., 0.52A
17W-28.3W
70° C

K6-233 APR (3.3v CORE)
VCore - 3.3V (3.2V~3.4V), 3.5V Max., 9.75A
VI/O - 3.3V (3.135V~3.6V), 4.0V Max., 0.52A
18.2W-30.2W
70° C

You can also use WAMonitor to set up the CPU once Windows loads.

What OS do you intend to use?
ajzchips
El cheapo dude
Posts: 3048
Joined: Sat Mar 23, 2002 12:41 pm
Location: Madrid, Spain

Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:22 pm

FYI, I've had a 3.2V K6-233 working just fine on an old PCCHIPS VX board at 3.3V (single-voltage). Just be careful with the VRM because it does get really hot... I had it working at 3x75=225MHz (better performance than 66.6x3.5=233MHz) with good EDO SIMMs :D
The board still works fine, after 5 years 8O (PCCHIPS M520)
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 pm

Atm is installed win95 4.00.650A (the first version), but i will soon install win95 osr2.5 (4.00.650C), and maybe a Dos 6.22 partition too (maybe modified with those newer exes from win95 and win98 bootdisks).

I think that i will remove the pci 10/100 lan card (used for my internet connection) and the ess1868 isa audio card and mount instead an isa 10mbit lan card, a sound blaster awe64 gold pnp isa and a pci usb card for adding usb port (that's why i will install w95 osr2.5).

I think that i will run it at 66x3 (about 200mhz) (my mainboard max setting) or 66x2, if k6 has the same feature that k6-2 and k6-3 use for making x2x2 (x4) internal and run at full speed on old mbs.
ajzchips
El cheapo dude
Posts: 3048
Joined: Sat Mar 23, 2002 12:41 pm
Location: Madrid, Spain

Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:39 pm

Be careful... full speed implies full power which your mobo's VRM may not be able to provide...
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:44 pm

What's mean VRM?

Voltage Regulator M... oo? :D

Seriously, i dunno :oops:
cp
BIOS Guru
Posts: 1914
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 9:07 pm
Location: Germany

Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:19 pm

1.5x is 3.5x on the AMD K6 (3.5x 66.6MHz = 233MHz)
2x is 6x on CXT cores only (AMD K6-2, 2.2v core, maked 26351)

VRM is Voltage Regulator Module.

get a K6-233 ANR as KachiWachi already pointed out. my guess is that the regulator is build around the LP2951 and a D45H8 (could you please post the markings of the power transistor?). this combination is able to supply 8A continous current. with additional cooling (really: add a 80mm fan on the cpu and let it overlap to the regulator heatsink. i've build many systems like this, they work just fine) your system will be able to run a full speed K6 233MHz. keep in mind that the regulator has to supply current for all other 3.3v devices on the mainboard, too (chipset!). if you don't intend to run number crunchers on the system you're safe as the regulator won't be stressed too much.

btw. the board has USB 1.1 onboard already. at least the VX chipset supplies two USB 1.1 ports. look for a 8-pin header (2x4-pin) and get a metal plate to cover the rear slots with build-in USB ports (hey, how are those things called? somebody help me out!). on the SL586V the USB port is left of the DIMM slot and below the SIMM slots (there's USB silkscreened below the header)
Space Marine
BIOS Rookie
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:17 am

Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:38 pm

About usb, i readed on manual that it should have something for connecting these, but i have had previous experiences with another mainboard (GA-7ZX, KT133 with Athlon900) much newer (2001) and it had non standard onboard connectors for usb2 "metal plates", infact i had to buy a pci usb 2 card for adding these to the board.

If a board from 2001 doesn't have standard ones, i dont think one from 1996 will have these, however i will try, i have some of these "plates" from other asus boards.

About the regulator "written on" numbers, i will check these in a pair of minutes :)


edit: k6 will be 3.2v core version, so anr
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